Yaris, Scion xD, Honda Fit - no water temp gauge

I've been thinking about what my next commute car is going to be. 80
miles/day, it's just me and my briefcase, so thinking of a small
vehicle with great gas mileage. Yaris hatchback, Scion xD, or Honda
Fit would work for me. Problem is, none of them has a water temp
gauge, just an "idiot light."

Would you consider buying a car (brand new) that only has the water
temp "idiot light", but no water temp _gauge_ ?

Btw, do these "idiot lights" come on early enough to prevent major
engine damage, or only after the engine has overheated to the point
where the head gasket is blown?

Also, the next bigger models that do have the water temp gauge would
be Toyota Corolla, Matrix, or Honda Civic. But the extra purchase/
ownership cost may not even offset the possible repair costs resulting
from a Yaris/Fit/xD engine overheating (which, if happens, would be
several years down the road.)

TIA,
Bubba

 

If you maintain the vehicle well you should not have any cooling system
problems. If a guage is that important to you you can always install an
aftermarket gauge later.

 

An idiot light might not come on soon enough to prevent engine damage. On some vehicles if you loose coolant pressure because of a leak the boiling temperature will be too low to cause the idiot light to come on. It is getting harder to find vehicles with gauges. Most cars I have owned had temperature, voltage, and oil pressure gauges. My Fusion has only a temperature gauge.

 

Yes, I would.

It's usually an "operator malfunction" for some folks not acting quick
enough in response to a caution or warning light that is damaging. I've
heard it said many times "I saw the light but I didn't know what it
meant". I say to myself, hey, it's only money, why should you care.

If they didn't know what the light meant, I would doubt a gauge would be
any more meaningful to them. Sometimes to learn what a light means, they
see the results of driving with the low oil pressure light on in a sixty
thousand dollar car because the person (woman) did not act, they just
kept driving, until it stopped. Very instructional. Hubby was not happy.
Like I say, it's only money.

You sound like an aware type of person, so a light instead of a gauge
would be fine for you, but you could add an after market gauge if you
wanted.

I've been driving a Corolla when I'm not in a truck since '03 and IMHO
they are great cars, no problems.

 

None of them have oil pressure gauges either, or what a few years ago
would have been considered normal instrumentation. You MAY be able to
ask the dealer for a "gauge package" but the number of cars available
with real gauges is slim.

I wouldn't. But what is even WORSE are the fake gauges which you see on
an increasing number of cars. They look like real gauges, but they only
register three different levels. Apparently having gauges that move around
too much is "confusing" for the driver.

That depends. The basic idea is that they're supposed to come on well
before the point of damage. But there's really only one way to find out.

You can always install aftermarket gauges. And not that although I wouldn't
buy a car without gauges, I'm also a luddite who wouldn't buy most any car
made today.
--scott

 

*snip*

I'll trade you the temp gauge for your tachometer! 2000 Echoes didn't have
them.

Natalie

 

I don't believe that is true. The coolant does not have to boil for the
light to come on. The temp sensor only senses the temperature of the water, it
has no way to determine if it is boiling or not. What may happen with a sudden
leak is the coolant level will drop low enough that the temp sensor is no
longer immersed in coolant. Being the sensor is no longer in contact with the
coolant it will not turn the light on until it is too late.

I know. I prefer gauges myself but the are getting harder to find.

 

How is such an aftermarket temp gauge installed - under the hood, and
how is it mounted on the dashboard/instrument panel? How much does it
cost?

 

My 5 speed 2000 Civic has/had/offered no tach not even as an option
(thank goodness it DOES have a temp gauge) - it would have been such a
pain to install an after market (tach) I learned to do without.

 

An "idiot" light uses a sensor that is just a switch that flips once the
design temp is exceeded. But a true temperature gauge uses a sensor that
MEASURES the temp,and the gauge gives warning BEFORE the temp goes "over
the top". A gauge gives you more info,and sooner. A stuck thermostat may
cause your engine tempo to cycle from 'cold' to 'hot'(affecting mileage)
but an idiot light will not show that unless 'hot' exceeds the sensor
limit.But a gauge will show that variation,and will show an engine running
hotter than usual but within tolerance,showing something has changed[a
problem!],that an idiot light will ignore.
(until it's too late...)

Every car should have a temp gauge,not an idiot light.

 

Sure.

But if it really bothers you, it's easy to get devices that plug into
the OBD-II port and give you more information about your car than you
ever want to know. For example:

http://www.scangauge.com/

 

"Elmo P. Shagnasty"...

I agree with Elmo on this.
Tomes

 

Yes. On many of the cars that have gauges now the gauge is nothing
more than an idiot light with a needle. The gauge is either cold,
normal or hot. Same with oil pressure... It's either 0 or normal. I
was told manufacturers started doing this because people would bring a
car back in for warranty repair when the gauge reading was still
"normal" but not exactly like it always was.

They aren't as good as a gauge, but really who has cooling system
problems anymore? The last time I had a car overheat it was because a
hose blew out and in that case neither the gauge nor the idiot light
detected it in time to avoid damage. Since neither was in water
anymore they didn't detect the rising temp until waayyy to late.

I wouldn't upgrade just for that feature. Replace all the hoses every
five years and don't worry about it.

 

why should you have to BUY what should be standard,that gives important
information?

 

If there is no pressure e.g. because of a loose cap the coolant can slowly boil away without the idiot light coming on. The same is true if you use only water with no antifreeze. The boiling point of water at sea level pressure is 212 degF. With 50% antifreeze and a high pressure radiator cap the boiling point will be about 270 degF. An idiot light might not come on until 240 degF.
You are correct about the light not coming on if the coolant is low. I have seen engines that became so hot that the the head gasket blows and the driver swears that the idiot light never came on.

 

why should you have to BUY what should be standard,that gives important
information?[/QUOTE]

Define "should". ALL cars are built on compromise. This particular
compromise is very small, and shouldn't make someone not want the car.

That they made a decision not to include it, is immaterial. If you want
the car, the $160 for a Scangauge may be easy enough to swallow to give
you the car AND the feature that you want in it.

 

depends if you stop when it first comes on or not.

truth is, water gauges are an historic anachronism. if you look at the
typical car's temp gauge, they don't have a linear response, it's a step
function. that means that when it's in the "normal" zone, there can be
considerable temperature variation and you'll never see any difference
in indicator position.

given that it's not really any interest when the coolant is cold, and
there is no visible variability under normal operating conditions, that
only leaves the "too hot" zone to be of any real interest - and there's
no reason it can't be served by an indicator light. in fact, it may be
a good deal more useful than a honda where if you don't happen to look
down at the gauge to catch a problem in time, you can easily cook an
engine. most people notice right away when a light comes on.

 

Yes, I would. I've had many vehicles with real gauges and a few of
them overheated and I never noticed the gauge go up because it
happened so fast (blown hose). I might have noticed an idiot light.
I'd like to have both in an ideal setup. It's nice to know what's
happening with water temp on a long uphill, esp if you are towing
something. My 99 Mustang GT has a temp, oil and volt gauge but all
are just idiot gauges. At least on the mustang you can put the
Dashboard odometer into "diagnostic mode" and it will give a true
digital readout of water temp. I think most idiot lights for water
temp are set to go on at about 235 degrees. If everything is good in
the cooling system it should not boil till it hits 260 degrees.

 

I agree, I think the ideal setup would be gauges with an idiot light
right inside the gauge. Unfortunately if you want something like that
you have to do it yourself.

nate

 

OTOH,my 94 Integra GS-R had a stuck thermostat,and I noticed the temp gauge
rising when I stopped and falling to 'Cold' when I was driving. I got the
parts and fixed it before anything worse happened.
And the last car I had with only an idiot light blew a rad hose (during a
Buffalo blizzard) and left me stranded out in the middle of
nowhere(Millersport Rd),except that a generous person stopped and gave me
and my bud a ride ALL the why home,quite out of their way. The idiot light
was useless to me.

Conclusion;idiot lights are for idiots.