Oil weight for '03 Civic

[Steve (archive)]

My 2003 HX coupe (CVT trans.) calls for 5W-20 motor oil. It says so in the owners' manual and there's a sticker right on the engine block that says "5W-20".

I'm due for an oil change but none of the places around me have 5W-20 -- they all tell me just to use 5W-30 (which is all anybody around here seems to stock).

Q: Why does the HX coupe w/CVT call for 5W-20 (instead of a more "common" weight) ?

Q: If I use 5W-30 (instead of 5W-20), what are the consequences?

 

[Jimmy]

My 2003 HX coupe (CVT trans.) calls for 5W-20 motor oil. It says so in the owners' manual and there's a sticker right on the engine block that says "5W-20".

I'm due for an oil change but none of the places around me have 5W-20 -- they all tell me just to use 5W-30 (which is all anybody around here seems to stock).

Q: Why does the HX coupe w/CVT call for 5W-20 (instead of a more "common" weight) ?

Q: If I use 5W-30 (instead of 5W-20), what are the consequences?

My '04 Civic LX also calls for 5W20 and has that on the oil-fill cap. I looked around and was only able to find a quart or two at most at several auto parts stores in my area (NC). I just found a case of Penzoil 5-20 when I was in a Walmart here and so I went ahead and picked it up. I just crossed the 1,000 mile mark on mine and don't plan on changing the oil until 5,000 miles and then every 5,000 miles after that. You can change the oil on your car yourself and as long as you keep records and receipts of it then you'll still be covered under your warranty. I realize I didn't answer any of your questions, but figured maybe you'd wanna know you can find 5W20 if you look enough and also that you can change your own oil and still be covered by warranty. Good luck.

 

[George Macdonald]

My 2003 HX coupe (CVT trans.) calls for 5W-20 motor oil. It says so in the owners' manual and there's a sticker right on the engine block that says "5W-20".

I'm due for an oil change but none of the places around me have 5W-20 -- they all tell me just to use 5W-30 (which is all anybody around here seems to stock).

Most of the lube mfrs now make 5W/20 in some of their grades so it is available - your local vendors are probably just reluctant to dedicate shelf space to oil which is recommended by only two auto mfrs, Ford and Honda. The one notable exception is Mobil1 which is not available in 5W/20; to tell the truth I think it may be quite difficult to make a true synthetic with such a narrow viscosity range.

Q: Why does the HX coupe w/CVT call for 5W-20 (instead of a more "common" weight) ?

The question has been much discussed here in the past if you want to search for previous posts at http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search

It's everything from a plot to make our engines fail earlier to the advancement of metallurgy and lubricants technology. My POV is that it's something the EPA is ramming down our throats by way of the auto mfrs as an "energy conserving" measure. The difference in mpg is barely measurable and easily voided by different individual driving habits.

Q: If I use 5W-30 (instead of 5W-20), what are the consequences?

My opinion: the 5W/30 willl give you a slight extra margin of engine protection, over the 5W/20, at high ambient temps, say >90F. I'd use the 5W/30. In fact, if you don't live in the frost belt, I'd use 10W/30.

The next time you go to the Honda/Acura dealer parts dept, they may have a counter mat which lists the oil grade reqts by model. Take a good look at at it and ask yourself why Honda still recommends 10W/30 for the S2000 and NSX.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

 

[y_p_w]

Most of the lube mfrs now make 5W/20 in some of their grades so it is available - your local vendors are probably just reluctant to dedicate shelf space to oil which is recommended by only two auto mfrs, Ford and Honda. The one notable exception is Mobil1 which is not available in 5W/20; to tell the truth I think it may be quite difficult to make a true synthetic with such a narrow viscosity range.

There are a few synthetic blends in 5W-20 weight. One is Castrol Syntec, which some believe is dubiously labelled as such. The other is Pennzoil "SUV, Truck, and Minivan", although it may be hard to find.

Mobil 1 0W-20 is labelled as suitable for 5W-20 applications. I theing that's the factory oil weight for Honda hybrid engines. The original weight of Mobil 1 25 years ago was 5W-20.

The question has been much discussed here in the past if you want to search for previous posts at http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search

It's everything from a plot to make our engines fail earlier to the advancement of metallurgy and lubricants technology. My POV is that it's something the EPA is ramming down our throats by way of the auto mfrs as an "energy conserving" measure. The difference in mpg is barely measurable and easily voided by different individual driving habits.

I saw the spec sheet for Havoline motor oil. All weights from 5W-30 to 20W-50 and single weights contained 0.103% zinc (by weight). The exception was 5W-20, which is 0.112%. A zinc compound is an anti-wear additive - right?

<http://library.cbest.chevron.com/lubes/compprd9.nsf/c88c682625e06af6882568db00737ce8/d1099203c4293c4f88256b5600791e6c/$FILE/PCMO-2210.pdf>

BTW - I've suspected that Chevron Supreme motor oil may be the same since the ChevronTexaco merger. However - the spec sheet seems to be different.

My opinion: the 5W/30 willl give you a slight extra margin of engine protection, over the 5W/20, at high ambient temps, say >90F. I'd use the 5W/30. In fact, if you don't live in the frost belt, I'd use 10W/30.

The next time you go to the Honda/Acura dealer parts dept, they may have a counter mat which lists the oil grade reqts by model. Take a good look at at it and ask yourself why Honda still recommends 10W/30 for the S2000 and NSX.

These are extremely high revving engines. However - the Integra GS-R and other DOHC VTEC engines are similar and 5W-30 is the recommended weight. MY new WRX recommends 5W-30, but says 10W-30 and 10W-40(??) are acceptable for normal driving above. The manual even advises using 30, 40, 20W-40, or 20W-50 if you're towing or it's really hot. Europeans are used to using heavier grades (with longer drains), and their motor oils are subject to a higher standard than API SL. OTOH - they typically won't keep a car beyond maybe 60K miles.

 

[John Horner]

My 2003 HX coupe (CVT trans.) calls for 5W-20 motor oil. It says so in the owners' manual and there's a sticker right on the engine block that says "5W-20".

I'm due for an oil change but none of the places around me have 5W-20 -- they all tell me just to use 5W-30 (which is all anybody around here seems to stock).

Q: Why does the HX coupe w/CVT call for 5W-20 (instead of a more "common" weight) ?

Q: If I use 5W-30 (instead of 5W-20), what are the consequences?

I suspect that the only consequence of using slightly thicker oil in your Civic would be some reduction in fuel economy.

Honda branded motor oil is 10W-30 oils when they sell their vehicles in Australia. http://www.honda.com.au/buying+a+honda/parts/index.htm click on Honda oil

Some good 5W-20 oils include Motorcraft 5W-20, Pennzoil "SUV, Truck, Minivan" 5W-20 and Castrol Syntec Blend 5W-20. All three of these are part dino oil, part synthetic and have yielded good oil analysis results as posted on the discussion board at:

Go to:

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=forum;f=3

Search on Honda. You will find lots of results of various oils in use in Hondas including both 5W-20 and other grades.

John

 

[George Macdonald]

There are a few synthetic blends in 5W-20 weight. One is Castrol Syntec, which some believe is dubiously labelled as such.

Castrol's own confession tells us the truth of the matter:
http://www.castrolusa.com/syntecresponse.html

I saw the spec sheet for Havoline motor oil. All weights from 5W-30 to 20W-50 and single weights contained 0.103% zinc (by weight). The exception was 5W-20, which is 0.112%. A zinc compound is an anti-wear additive - right?

<http://library.cbest.chevron.com/lubes/compprd9.nsf/c88c682625e06af6882568db00737ce8/d1099203c4293c4f88256b5600791e6c/$FILE/PCMO-2210.pdf>

BTW - I've suspected that Chevron Supreme motor oil may be the same since the ChevronTexaco merger. However - the spec sheet seems to be different.

<http://library.cbest.chevron.com/lubes/compprd9.nsf/c88c682625e06af6882568db00737ce8/c748bacbd316e79a88256a0000786813/$FILE/PCMO-20.pdf>

Zinc dialkyl dithiophosphate, ZDDP, was the usual anti-wear additive, which has been forcibly reduced by new regs and the auto mfrs. The more recent anti-wear additive is molybdenum dialkyl dithiocarbamate. As for the difference between Chevron/Texaco lubes, the Equilon/Motiva settlement had a delayed effect which varied in differing parts of the country due to the FCC ruling on the merger/breakup. Only recently have some of the Texaco gas stations converted to Shell here in the N.East; I believe, in the West things may have happened earlier with a conversion to Chevron. I've no idea what Chevron's plans are for the other Texaco brand names - probably depends on the market.

These are extremely high revving engines. However - the Integra GS-R and other DOHC VTEC engines are similar and 5W-30 is the recommended weight.

Even that was not always the case - for the earlier models, e.g. for the '92 GS-R, 5W/30 was only approved up to ambient temps of 32F[sic], while the 10W/30 was indicated as good down to 0F. I don't believe there has been that much improvement in lubricants since then and there has been a reduction in anti-wear additive... with the more recent replacement by MoDDC. I *am* wary of the auto mfrs' willingness to experiment with the longevity of *our* vehicles.

MY new WRX recommends 5W-30, but says 10W-30 and 10W-40(??) are acceptable for normal driving above. The manual even advises using 30, 40, 20W-40, or 20W-50 if you're towing or it's really hot. Europeans are used to using heavier grades (with longer drains), and their motor oils are subject to a higher standard than API SL. OTOH - they typically won't keep a car beyond maybe 60K miles.

"Higher standard"? I'm pretty sure the API spec'd lubricants would pass any of the equivalent Euro specs.

Rgds, George Macdonald

"Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who, me??

 

[y_p_w]

I suspect that the only consequence of using slightly thicker oil in your Civic would be some reduction in fuel economy.

Honda branded motor oil is 10W-30 oils when they sell their vehicles in Australia. http://www.honda.com.au/buying+a+honda/parts/index.htm click on Honda oil

Some good 5W-20 oils include Motorcraft 5W-20, Pennzoil "SUV, Truck, Minivan" 5W-20 and Castrol Syntec Blend 5W-20. All three of these are part dino oil, part synthetic and have yielded good oil analysis results as posted on the discussion board at:

There is some controversy over whether or not Castrol North America's current "Syntec" is really synthetic. It's a type III base oil, if I recall correctly. The strange thing about Motorcraft 5W-20, is every place I've seen it, the price is substantially higher than the other Motorcraft oil weights - like $1.81/qt vs $1.20/qt for 5W-30. The cheapest 5W-20 oil I've seen is Coastal (at AutoZone).

 

[Bebop]

The strange thing about Motorcraft 5W-20, is every
place I've seen it, the price is substantially higher than the other Motorcraft oil weights - like $1.81/qt vs $1.20/qt for 5W-30. The cheapest 5W-20 oil I've seen is Coastal (at AutoZone).

It's $1.30 at wal-mart.

 

[E. Meyer]

My 2003 HX coupe (CVT trans.) calls for 5W-20 motor oil. It says so in the owners' manual and there's a sticker right on the engine block that says "5W-20".

I'm due for an oil change but none of the places around me have 5W-20 -- they all tell me just to use 5W-30 (which is all anybody around here seems to stock).

Q: Why does the HX coupe w/CVT call for 5W-20 (instead of a more "common" weight) ?

Q: If I use 5W-30 (instead of 5W-20), what are the consequences?

Every car I've ever owned had a table in the owners manual that showed what weight oils could be used for various ambient temperature ranges. Have they stopped putting this in the book? If its in there, I'll bet 5w-30 is on it.

 

[y_p_w]

It's $1.30 at wal-mart.

I was buying oil at Wal-mart (Union City, California) last night. I saw Motorcraft 5W-20 was $1.81/quart while 5W-30, 10W-30, and 20W-50 was $1.36/quart. Of course every Wal-Mart has it's own prices set differently (the 5 quart bottle of Mobil 1 is $2 more at another Wal-Mart just 10 miles North).

Motorcraft 5W-20 is labelled "semi-synthetic", while the other weights aren't. I think the 5W-20 label said it was a blend of synthetic and hydrocracked base oils, while the other weights just said they used hydrocracked base oils.

 

[y_p_w]

Every car I've ever owned had a table in the owners manual that showed what weight oils could be used for various ambient temperature ranges. Have they stopped putting this in the book? If its in there, I'll bet 5w-30 is on it.

Honda has typically said 5W-30 and 10W-30 for the past however many years. Then they recommended 10W-30 for a few unique engines such as the NSX or the S2000. I also had the salesperson go over the manual and recommend 20W-50 and/or 10W-40 - esp if it starts using oil.

That being said, other manufacturers owners manuals have a table, then additional recommendations based on ambient temps or extreme duty. I remember the manual for my dad's '96 Buick Regal recommended synthetic 5W-30 for subzero climates. I heard GM later added 0W-30 to the list of cold weather oil. My new Subaru owner's manual has a list of 5W-30, 10W-30, and 10W-40 as recommended weights. Then a separate section recommends 30wt, 40wt, 10W-50, 20W-40, or 20W-50 for extreme temps or towing.

 

[John Horner]

It takes a blend of Synthetic and Dino motor oils to meet Motorcrafts specs for the 5W-20, so it is priced higher because the mfg. cost is higher.

I would NOT look for the cheapest 5W-20 to put in my new car HELLO!

John

 

[Bebop]

Every car I've ever owned had a table in the owners manual that showed what weight oils could be used for various ambient temperature ranges. Have they stopped putting this in the book? If its in there, I'll bet 5w-30 is on it.

it's 5W-20 at all temperatures for most of the Hondas.

 

[y_p_w]

It takes a blend of Synthetic and Dino motor oils to meet Motorcrafts specs for the 5W-20, so it is priced higher because the mfg. cost is higher.

I would NOT look for the cheapest 5W-20 to put in my new car HELLO!

I wasn't really suggesting that anyone go out and use an off-brand. I don't think I've ever tried an off-brand motor oil before. However - Coastal was the first off-brand 5W-20 I've seen.

From what I understand, the Motorcraft 5W-20 is a very good product, regardless of who makes it for Ford.